Introducing the Individuals
First Participant: Peter, 34, from London
Profession Ex- government employee, currently a student studying community health
Political history Voted the Green Party recently (and a member of the party); previously Labour. Describes himself as “progressive, and globalist rather than nationalist”
Amuse bouche A sketch of a teacup Peter did as a kid was once hung in the Irish National Gallery
Second Participant: A., 43, from Harrow
Occupation Risk analyst in the infrastructure industry
Voting record Hailing from the Indian subcontinent, Akshat has lived in the UK for five years, and voted the Conservative Party. Describes himself as “somewhat right of centre”
Amuse bouche He self-learned to understand the Urdu language. “It has no practical use for me, I was just fascinated”
Initial impressions
Akshat During the past two decades, I’ve lived and worked in the Middle East, East Asia, the United States. The issues Peter and I talked about are focused on Britain, but they are also universal, because human life more or less follows the same curve across the world. I anticipated a staunch liberal, but he was quite measured – we had a productive, logical conversation. I had a couple of beers, he opted for mojitos.
The second participant We split starters – seafood rolls, dumplings, radish cakes with sprouts, which were superb. I felt somewhat anxious, as I think Akshat was. Would he criticize me for being a snowflake? We each have immigrant backgrounds. My childhood was in Dublin; I’ve lived in the United States and Spain. We connected through our affection for London.
The big beef
Akshat I look at migration similar to adding salt to a meal. With a small amount, the food is delicious. Use too little or too much and the meal is insipid or overly seasoned.
The second participant He had a metaphor about seasoning. It would be odd to exist if the state was selecting some preferred demographic of the nation.
The first participant There are, unfortunately, individuals fleeing persecution, but a lot of migrants coming to the United Kingdom are economic migrants who may not contribute much and can burden the benefit system. Nobody forces you to go to a new country for opportunity, so you should only go if you are able to support your own needs and your relatives.
Peter We became confused with certain details. I don’t think it’s like you come over and are employed and then after five years you get indefinite leave to remain. No process is guaranteed. The climate has been unwelcoming since Theresa May, application costs are quite expensive, there is an healthcare levy, access to benefits is restricted. There is no special treatment for anyone. And regarding the new policies, whereby family reunification is restricted, it is astonishing to state: we want your work, but we don’t want you. I think we must maintain a certain level of humanity.
Common ground
The first participant Peter’s sceptical of unchecked capitalism. I am, too, but simultaneously, economic growth benefits society and ought to be promoted.
The second participant We’re both internationalist. And we agreed that some parts of society – government, the press – thrive off stoking division. We did find shared understanding in fundamentals and ethics.
Dessert and debate
Akshat Peter is of the opinion that because the United Kingdom benefitted from colonial times, it ought to provide compensation to those countries. I simply think: you cannot judge the past with contemporary ethics; eras vary, current society had no control of events 50 or 100 years ago. Let’s say the Britain was obliged to repay the Indian nation, it would be a huge amount of funds. Is Britain able to manage that? Certainly not.
The second participant Until recently, I don’t think there was much reckoning with colonial history. For example, upon my arrival to the UK, people had little knowledge of the Great Famine and the part that colonialism played in it. My view is decolonisation isn’t just about signing a cheque, it should be about examining past errors and where we should be now.
Final thoughts
The first participant It may not alter the my perspective, but I appreciate Peter’s concerns. I converse with people regularly with opinions are contrary to my own. The goal is uniting people to the same page, so that everyone can work towards the betterment of society.
Peter We remained for 150 minutes. He enjoyed a sweet treat and I had a Japanese dessert wine. I did not convince him of any point, but we each liked the meal, so we could hopefully be more receptive to having conversations with others in the coming times.
